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Post by lucky on May 25, 2005 10:32:41 GMT -5
All I want to say about last night has to do with Tech. Tech you can take your Pinky comment and stick it. But dude sweet car.
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Post by rjj on May 25, 2005 10:39:01 GMT -5
Hofer just told me that it was voted at the sports league meeting to raise the max from 640 to 645 - THAT IS SIMPLY UNBELIEVABLE! Teams were all formed - and my bet is 98% of them were formed with 640 in mind. My husband's team for one had to drop Bobo bowling with he and FRavel because they missed the max by 2 pins - so they took Ryan who is way less experienced then Bo so they could fit, and I am sure they are not the only ones who had to finagle to fit 640 - whoever voted for in favor of that is just wrong for that. I am going to stop short of saying stupid but if someone else wants to say go ahead and I will follow with an amen! I cannot wait to go next Tuesday and see just who did this. I am sure I know, but I LOVE BEING RIGHT and I will find my summer joy in nailing this one! It will be quite obvious by entering team averages who did this - I am 30 minutes past hearing this and I am still saying "I can't believe this was done" It's even worse than when we went into the Tues meeting last year and voted to have ratio be 4-1 when all teams were formed with a 3-2 ratio because that's what everyone thought all summer! I am competitive to a fault, and I love to win more than most but what comes with that is a COMPLETE SENSE OF FAIR PLAY and this is not fair at all. Livable, but certainly NOT FAIR PLAY. How did most of these people grow up playing games - putting 500.00 in the middle of the monopoly board?
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Post by rraquinas on May 25, 2005 10:39:49 GMT -5
Two dollars a week, bom is getting all riled up about.... doesn't make sense to me..... beside, $20.00 a week was voted in over his motion of $18.00 a week by an overwhelming majority of the league but somehow it's all my fault. If I hadn't had brought it up, someone else would have... Get over it bom... And since when has a different opinion mean being an idiot? I guess only when he or they are jealous.... I'm not the one coming on here complaining about anything or dogging anyone......Usually when people call other people names or dog them, they are just trying to cover up some of their own short comings...JMO... Actualy there was more to be said about the league expense but idiots kept interrupting the meeting and then there were some who insisted on trying to speed it up by seconding every motion put on the floor. Hickey never got to say what he wanted because there was very little order in the meeting and to many outburst. I would have like to of seen 15-16 dollars a night but we never got a chance to bring it up, WHY? Because of the village idiots! Next time one team representative only should be allowed. Extra votes aren't fair and shouldn't be counted. So anyways the shots they put out were descent, Ive bowled on a lot harder. I did notice they broke down fast and true to a normal sport shot. The long oil shot still had to much movement to be a true long oil shot, There was area to be had and yes there was still bounce if you played the shot deep enough and bounced 11-10. 9-6 seemed flat and 6 out was a grave yard that you had to square up to play with out the ball falling in the channel. The patterns weren't as equipment specific as I had thought they would be. I was able to use either of the 2 balls I had brought with me with success. I think it will get a little tougher as it goes though because of the human/weather/machine/striper and oil variables will vary a little witch equals large contrast from week to week on sport shots. I am hoping for 170-180 average with the limited amount of bowling I am doing now. See you peeps there next week. As for only one representative...that is not what the rules meetings are for...everyone has a vote. The problem really is that you have a group of people that all think they know what is going on even when they don't. I find it funny! Plus, the way meetings are held is humorous. For example: We heard the rule about bowling against no-one before we talked about the scoring (4 pt or Peterson) now how could we just go through that rule without knowing that we would be on the 4 pt system. As for discussing the rules changes, that is the presidents job to keep th meeting running...he could have asked the sergeant of arms to kick the people talking out... Also a motion does not go straight to a vote, it should be discussed and then voted on since you have to vote on one first. When the motion was made to pay $20, it should have been discussed cause no other motion (other than to a] floor the vote to allow for more discussion or b] resend the seconding or motion) can be made anyway. The moment the motion to pay 20 had the majority, that was it...the other motion was pointless...it then takes 100% of the league to change the rule. That is why you discuss things and then vote...once voted on it is the rule. But then there are many things that crack me up about bowling meetings. Some people know that everyone is invited, some people think it is just the team captains (that is why the teams that know get "extra" votes.) People think the secretary is the one that runs the meetings...no it is the president, the secretary/tres should take notes (Yes, that means that Roger should have been taking notes and JH talking.) People think that the secretary is the one that you go to with rules problems - again that is wrong it is the President, who if needs be, should be the one to inform the sergeant of arms about a situation. P.S. - We have spell check now...think about using it! |
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Post by rjj on May 25, 2005 10:42:51 GMT -5
Tech and BOM are right - 20.00 is too steep for summer for a new format league. You can't make any money in league anyway - so lower the amount to 17-18 and let people try to earn their lunch money in brackets!!
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Post by rraquinas on May 25, 2005 10:43:12 GMT -5
With PERFECT as a team mate, I think I really want to beat him, but I will admit he does throw the ball well. Thanks for the compliment Aqua and your right, you and anyone else will have their work cut out for them to out average me in this league or anyother...lol.... It's been done before though and on more than one occasion but I have earned the right to say that I am always a strong contender for high average in any league I bowl in.... ;D Honestly, I have set my personal goal to be 205 to 210 in average in this league... Of course with that compliment also comes the responsibility of pulling your weight (which is quite a lot)!!!! |
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Post by rraquinas on May 25, 2005 10:53:56 GMT -5
Hofer just told me that it was voted at the sports league meeting to raise the max from 640 to 645 - THAT IS SIMPLY UNBELIEVABLE! Teams were all formed - and my bet is 98% of them were formed with 640 in mind. My husband's team for one had to drop Bobo bowling with he and FRavel because they missed the max by 2 pins - so they took Ryan who is way less experienced then Bo so they could fit, and I am sure they are not the only ones who had to finagle to fit 640 - whoever voted for in favor of that is just wrong for that. I am going to stop short of saying stupid but if someone else wants to say go ahead and I will follow with an amen! I cannot wait to go next Tuesday and see just who did this. I am sure I know, but I LOVE BEING RIGHT and I will find my summer joy in nailing this one! It will be quite obvious by entering team averages who did this - I am 30 minutes past hearing this and I am still saying "I can't believe this was done" It's even worse than when we went into the Tues meeting last year and voted to have ratio be 4-1 when all teams were formed with a 3-2 ratio because that's what everyone thought all summer! I am competitive to a fault, and I love to win more than most but what comes with that is a COMPLETE SENSE OF FAIR PLAY and this is not fair at all. Livable, but certainly NOT FAIR PLAY. How did most of these people grow up playing games - putting 500.00 in the middle of the monopoly board? Okay...two things... I am one of many that voted for it. The league has never been before and 640 was the recommended setting but not mandatory or set by the league. We made our team with the 640 in mind, but I also knew that if we were close to the edge that we might be able to get that voted in. I like 645 better as it is actually divisable by 3 215/bowler. The people that put the $500 in the middle are stupid. Have to agree with you there...but in the since of fair play, it is fair, everyone has the same chance of hitting it as long as you continue to put 500 in the middle. They could still have bobo as a fourth member if they choose...the league allows for 6 member teams. I know that they may not have asked Ryan at all if they had known this (or maybe for him to be the sub) but I would think they had to know that this could happen. |
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Post by lucky on May 25, 2005 11:01:21 GMT -5
Good job to the Hitman. He had all his information, all his facts and everything in order. He had an answer for any question that arose last night.
Good Job Hitman.
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Post by rraquinas on May 25, 2005 11:01:40 GMT -5
Tech and BOM are right - 20.00 is too steep for summer for a new format league. You can't make any money in league anyway - so lower the amount to 17-18 and let people try to earn their lunch money in brackets!! I think either make it 15 or make it 20...the argument over 24 dollars doesn't mean anything to me...and since 18 was the other one brought up, all I can say is BLAH BLAH BLAH. Now...I already pointed out that there should have been discussion and someone could have mentioned 15...$60 is something a little more...but on the same token...no one said anything on this forum when we were talking about $20...So why was it such a shock to everyone. In the original thread someone asked how much it would cost and the the answer was "Probably $20". No one had issues then...no one said "man that is high" we also knew that lineage would be 9.50 cause if you remember Perfect complaining about how that wasn't much of a discount for league bowlers. So everyone should have figured that that meant about $10 for prize fund....Why no comments before now?  |
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Post by MrPerfect on May 25, 2005 11:06:02 GMT -5
Hofer just told me that it was voted at the sports league meeting to raise the max from 640 to 645 - THAT IS SIMPLY UNBELIEVABLE! Teams were all formed - and my bet is 98% of them were formed with 640 in mind. My husband's team for one had to drop Bobo bowling with he and FRavel because they missed the max by 2 pins - so they took Ryan who is way less experienced then Bo so they could fit, and I am sure they are not the only ones who had to finagle to fit 640 - whoever voted for in favor of that is just wrong for that. I am going to stop short of saying stupid but if someone else wants to say go ahead and I will follow with an amen! I cannot wait to go next Tuesday and see just who did this. I am sure I know, but I LOVE BEING RIGHT and I will find my summer joy in nailing this one! It will be quite obvious by entering team averages who did this - I am 30 minutes past hearing this and I am still saying "I can't believe this was done" It's even worse than when we went into the Tues meeting last year and voted to have ratio be 4-1 when all teams were formed with a 3-2 ratio because that's what everyone thought all summer! I am competitive to a fault, and I love to win more than most but what comes with that is a COMPLETE SENSE OF FAIR PLAY and this is not fair at all. Livable, but certainly NOT FAIR PLAY. How did most of these people grow up playing games - putting 500.00 in the middle of the monopoly board? rjj, James H. brought up the fact that one or two teams were at 641 to 643 he suggested that we increase the entering max... Instead of possibly losing these teams, (our team was not one of them... we are way under, like 620 something) I made a motion to increase it to 645 it was second, voted on and passed by the league. Last night was your chance to voice your concerns of this, today on the forum is not....JMO.... Let's keep in mind that this is a new league and there are not any rules set in stone until the end of the first meeting and league rules adopted by the league with a vote. The "Rules" that you are referring to, was only a guideline that the league was advertised around but nothing of that is set in stone. Besides, these 5 pins in total team average is not going to give anyone a distinct advantage on the sport shot. Everyone will be setting averages the first night and that will be what the handicap is based off of. (Which is 75% of 200 individually)... |
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Post by hitman on May 25, 2005 11:09:08 GMT -5
Well..sure are some people critizing the way the league was set up, even one who was not there. BS..the 645 raised team average was brought up, discussed and APPROVED by everyone but ONE FREAKING vote. Do you think if it was that big of a deal the people would of said something? Give me break on this one..show up and vote or shut the hell up. The money issue was voted on by a majority as well. 18 vs 20 was voted on...and passed by a Majority for 20. Meeting was planned well in advance and anybody that wanted to could attend. Fravel was there for his team. People shooting off there comments that were not even there, those are the stupid ones.
Thanks to all who helped last night, and a big nod to Rusty Davis who spent over 4 hours running tapes and getting them read. We did 3 pattern runs last night and he had to run tapes on all three. The 2 we are using required 4 taped reads for 2 lanes each, EACH pattern.
This is my first league to set up, if it was not handled perfectly, my bad. There is a LOT to get ready for this type league. But unless you want to get you A** and start the league yourself, do not be so quick to critizize.
Thanks for all your time.
JH
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Post by MrPerfect on May 25, 2005 11:14:02 GMT -5
Well..sure are some people critizing the way the league was set up, even one who was not there. BS..the 645 raised team average was brought up, discussed and APPROVED by everyone but ONE FREAKING vote. Do you think if it was that big of a deal the people would of said something? Give me break on this one..show up and vote or shut the hell up. The money issue was voted on by a majority as well. 18 vs 20 was voted on...and passed by a Majority for 20. Meeting was planned well in advance and anybody that wanted to could attend. Fravel was there for his team. People shooting off there comments that were not even there, those are the stupid ones. Thanks to all who helped last night, and a big nod to Rusty Davis who spent over 4 hours running tapes and getting them read. We did 3 pattern runs last night and he had to run tapes on all three. The 2 we are using required 4 taped reads for 2 lanes each, EACH pattern. This is my first league to set up, if it was not handled perfectly, my bad. There is a LOT to get ready for this type league. But unless you want to get you A** and start the league yourself, do not be so quick to critizize. Thanks for all your time. JH I think you have done a great job so far.... Keep up the good work. |
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Post by rraquinas on May 25, 2005 11:15:12 GMT -5
Well..sure are some people critizing the way the league was set up, even one who was not there. BS..the 645 raised team average was brought up, discussed and APPROVED by everyone but ONE FREAKING vote. Do you think if it was that big of a deal the people would of said something? Give me break on this one..show up and vote or shut the hell up. The money issue was voted on by a majority as well. 18 vs 20 was voted on...and passed by a Majority for 20. Meeting was planned well in advance and anybody that wanted to could attend. Fravel was there for his team. People shooting off there comments that were not even there, those are the stupid ones. Thanks to all who helped last night, and a big nod to Rusty Davis who spent over 4 hours running tapes and getting them read. We did 3 pattern runs last night and he had to run tapes on all three. The 2 we are using required 4 taped reads for 2 lanes each, EACH pattern. This is my first league to set up, if it was not handled perfectly, my bad. There is a LOT to get ready for this type league. But unless you want to get you A** and start the league yourself, do not be so quick to critizize. Thanks for all your time. JH Someone get him some good drugs... Hey, don't let anything get to you...I was there and I think I have both defended and criticized the process. But I criticize not just our meeting, but all meetings. Yours was no different than any other league meeting. Sadly enough, there is never a way to make everyone happy...it just doesn't work. The league voted, and if people were really that upset they could have not taken an envelope and moved on. As for anything else...Well, let water roll off your back and never cry over spilled milk. What could have been done better will be done in the future, and that is life. You did a great job getting not only the league formed, but being informed about the issues, and having the information you passes out to the team reps. Now sit back and enjoy the league and have fun...there are plenty of us to help you out when you need it!!! |
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Post by rjj on May 25, 2005 11:24:23 GMT -5
Number 1 - 640 was not "suggested" it was what everyone thought the max was - just like it was said ending fall league averages would be used for this league - no telling how many people decided for or against this league based on these 2 things. The way you are acting HICKEY - you should have just told everyone - there are no rules to go by AT ALL all rules will be voted on the night of the meeting - which averages to use, what the max will be, what time etc etc - but that's not what you did. You garnished interest in this league with a couple of certains, the max being one of them. You just don't want to admit now that you backpeddled and couldn't stand up to those teams that didn't fit, God can only imagine why. As far as me keeping my mouth shut, I can say any d**n thing on here I want, and IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT - don't read it - BUD! I didn't want to go to the meeting, I had to watch paint dry at my house, I can comment on the fairness of a sport all day long and not go to a "meeting" I am not even bowling that league because i knew by who all was involved how this thing would evolve. Just because you like the 80's doesn't mean you are the age you were in 1980 - so quit being so "play like I play or go home" I will comment on all of it from now on - you can bet. You have to run those meetings with order, and i don't care if the vote was 100% - it should never have been allowed to be voted on - it was a certain. As for Russ, they should have known it would happen? You are right about that, but not for the reason you stated - they should have known because these things happen at every league beginning. They should just have known, you are right. I knew there would be controversy, that's why I stayed home and watched BO and Carrie - They just should have known!!!!!
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Post by MrPerfect on May 25, 2005 11:24:34 GMT -5
This is just a personal opinion.
Sport leagues for the most part are bowled in by your hard core bowlers. (Not new bowlers) I don't think that any bowling center manager will recommend that a new bowler bowl in a Sport league. Even though this is a new league, it's not filled with a bunch of new bowlers, so I don't think we need to take a new league mentality when setting it up.
Also,
Two dollars a night is nothing, that is like buying a new gas guzzling SUV and worry about it's gas mileage, because if you do, you can't afford the car....JMO... If you can't afford 20.00 bucks a night, how can you realistically argue that 18.00 a night keeps you within budget.... Let's get real here...JMO... Even at 20.00 bucks a night with only 3 people per team, I doubt that even 1st place breaks even for the season....
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Post by MrPerfect on May 25, 2005 11:33:34 GMT -5
Number 1 - 640 was not "suggested" it was what everyone thought the max was - just like it was said ending fall league averages would be used for this league - no telling how many people decided for or against this league based on these 2 things. The way you are acting HICKEY - you should have just told everyone - there are no rules to go by AT ALL all rules will be voted on the night of the meeting - which averages to use, what the max will be, what time etc etc - but that's not what you did. You garnished interest in this league with a couple of certains, the max being one of them. You just don't want to admit now that you backpeddled and couldn't stand up to those teams that didn't fit, God can only imagine why. As far as me keeping my mouth shut, I can say any d**n thing on here I want, and IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT - don't read it - BUD! I didn't want to go to the meeting, I had to watch paint dry at my house, I can comment on the fairness of a sport all day long and not go to a "meeting" I am not even bowling that league because i knew by who all was involved how this thing would evolve. Just because you like the 80's doesn't mean you are the age you were in 1980 - so quit being so "play like I play or go home" I will comment on all of it from now on - you can bet. You have to run those meetings with order, and i don't care if the vote was 100% - it should never have been allowed to be voted on - it was a certain. As for Russ, they should have known it would happen? You are right about that, but not for the reason you stated - they should have known because these things happen at every league beginning. They should just have known, you are right. I knew there would be controversy, that's why I stayed home and watched BO and Carrie - They just should have known!!!!! rjj, I love you and respect you... but you are just plain wrong on this issue over the rules.... The things you heard and thought to be rules "in your mind" were not, they are only guidelines at that point and what James and the house was wanting to guide this league towards. Nothing became rules until the end of the league meeting when voted on and passed. Because the league bowlers (that show up to the first meeting) and only the bowlers can set rules for a league and that is done by majority vote. You can disagree with any of them but nothing was done wrong and it was a majority vote, not a dictatorship..... ;D |
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