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Post by XBOM on Feb 6, 2006 13:10:51 GMT -5
What good does it matter to compete locally when your are overlook EVERY YEAR Hall of Fame. Hall of Fame should consider all bowling not just a local bowling.Anybody can be a great house bowler. A great bowler competes in all facet of the game. Sorry thats what I feel. I sorry but I have to agree with olepro on this one. I have honor scores in 11 different houses, including a 300 at State and a 300 in Pasadena City Tourn. and in a PBA Qualifier back in 1984. A testament of a bowlers true ability comes to light in SCRATCH Tourns., bowling under the pressure of bowlers of the same ability, not in league play or Handicapped Tourns. To me, league play is practice and is no where near the pressure of scratch tourns. bowling against top level bowlers....JMO... It's not our fault that some of you didn't bowl PBA events and/or Nationals at all or not as much as some of us. We weren't lucky, we were good enough to attract backers and put up money based on our abilities... Once again how someone votes is questioned!!!!!!!!! While out of town STATS are impressive to me because I didn't get the opportunity to do it #sob# To some of the other board members who are older and raised families and didn't have the chance to bowl across the country when younger those STATS may NOT mean anything to them #stupid# JMO
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Post by MrPerfect on Feb 6, 2006 14:14:59 GMT -5
I sorry but I have to agree with olepro on this one. I have honor scores in 11 different houses, including a 300 at State and a 300 in Pasadena City Tourn. and in a PBA Qualifier back in 1984. A testament of a bowlers true ability comes to light in SCRATCH Tourns., bowling under the pressure of bowlers of the same ability, not in league play or Handicapped Tourns. To me, league play is practice and is no where near the pressure of scratch tourns. bowling against top level bowlers....JMO... It's not our fault that some of you didn't bowl PBA events and/or Nationals at all or not as much as some of us. We weren't lucky, we were good enough to attract backers and put up money based on our abilities... So what you are saying in short is that unless the honor score is in a SCRATCH tournament, it's not worth mentioning. Most scratch tournaments aren't sanctioned, so most people don't keep up with those honor scores. It's like shooting 300 in a pot game...it doesn't count for anything except winning the pot that game. It's not mentioned or anything. The pressure of shooting a 300 in a HANDICAPPED tournament is the same as a SCRATCH tournament, so I don't know where you get off with that statement. I was talking about winning scratch events or doing well in them. I'm not trying to relate scratch Tourns to shooting honor scores but shooting them in big Tourns., is more prestigious than in league......Besides, what does honor scores mean these days, anymore?.....I've had 21 ABC/USBC Sanctioned one's and 10 of my 300's have come in the last 5 years.... To me, honors score counts are not a testament to ones abilities, it's beating the other bowlers on the same day on the same shot in big events.... In todays bowling environment, it's beating your fellow competitors what ever the scores are... And there is a difference from bowling league play and handicapped tourns. as opposed to bowling, City, State, Nationals, PBA events and even SASBA....In league play, you know the shot, the people and your in the routine of bowling each week and have a comfort zone with that. But going to a new environment and shot, bowling against bowlers of same ability and better, like current and past PBA title holders, is a totally different story than bowling against bowlers that you know your better than 99% of them, there's no intimidation factor there. You are talking apples and oranges there.... and to me, Hall of Fame is more than Honor score counts, a lot more... Yes they are nice to have but to me and others, they are not the defining attribute to a bowlers credentials...
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Post by WineUdotKing on Feb 6, 2006 14:27:52 GMT -5
So what you are saying in short is that unless the honor score is in a SCRATCH tournament, it's not worth mentioning. Most scratch tournaments aren't sanctioned, so most people don't keep up with those honor scores. It's like shooting 300 in a pot game...it doesn't count for anything except winning the pot that game. It's not mentioned or anything. The pressure of shooting a 300 in a HANDICAPPED tournament is the same as a SCRATCH tournament, so I don't know where you get off with that statement. I was talking about winning scratch events or doing well in them. I'm not trying to relate scratch Tourns to shooting honor scores but shooting them in big Tourns., is more prestigious than in league......Besides, what does honor scores mean these days, anymore?.....I've had 21 ABC/USBC Sanctioned one's and 10 of my 300's have come in the last 5 years.... To me, honors score counts are not a testament to ones abilities, it's beating the other bowlers on the same day on the same shot in big events.... In todays bowling environment, it's beating your fellow competitors what ever the scores are... And there is a difference from bowling league play and handicapped tourns. as opposed to bowling, City, State, Nationals, PBA events and even SASBA....In league play, you know the shot, the people and your in the routine of bowling each week and have a comfort zone with that. But going to a new environment and shot, bowling against bowlers of same ability and better, like current and past PBA title holders, is a totally different story than bowling against bowlers that you know your better than 99% of them, there's no intimidation factor there. You are talking apples and oranges there.... and to me, Hall of Fame is more than Honor score counts, a lot more... Yes they are nice to have but to me and others, they are not the defining attribute to a bowlers credentials... Well I will tell you this. When I go to a Knights of Columbus State or International tournament, I have never been to the house we have to bowl in and there are alot of other 210+ bowlers bowling in those events that I'm having to bowl against along with the large amount of handicap that I'm up against. In City tournament, you are bowling in houses you are familiar with and should bowl well. State tournament seems to go to the same house about every 5 years or so. It's not like walking into a different house every year. #nsrtrts_104#
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Post by MrPerfect on Feb 6, 2006 14:41:00 GMT -5
I was talking about winning scratch events or doing well in them. I'm not trying to relate scratch Tourns to shooting honor scores but shooting them in big Tourns., is more prestigious than in league......Besides, what does honor scores mean these days, anymore?.....I've had 21 ABC/USBC Sanctioned one's and 10 of my 300's have come in the last 5 years.... To me, honors score counts are not a testament to ones abilities, it's beating the other bowlers on the same day on the same shot in big events.... In todays bowling environment, it's beating your fellow competitors what ever the scores are... And there is a difference from bowling league play and handicapped tourns. as opposed to bowling, City, State, Nationals, PBA events and even SASBA....In league play, you know the shot, the people and your in the routine of bowling each week and have a comfort zone with that. But going to a new environment and shot, bowling against bowlers of same ability and better, like current and past PBA title holders, is a totally different story than bowling against bowlers that you know your better than 99% of them, there's no intimidation factor there. You are talking apples and oranges there.... and to me, Hall of Fame is more than Honor score counts, a lot more... Yes they are nice to have but to me and others, they are not the defining attribute to a bowlers credentials... Well I will tell you this. When I go to a Knights of Columbus State or International tournament, I have never been to the house we have to bowl in and there are alot of other 210+ bowlers bowling in those events that I'm having to bowl against along with the large amount of handicap that I'm up against. In City tournament, you are bowling in houses you are familiar with and should bowl well. State tournament seems to go to the same house about every 5 years or so. It's not like walking into a different house every year. #nsrtrts_104# In addition to my 300 at State in 1994, I also have a State Doubles Title in 1986....just an FYI and the Title means more to me than the 300 game at State...That's the point I'm saying...it's just my opinion.... Nothing against Knights of Columbus, I'm sure it's a great organization...but your talking about house bowers that are 210 +....that's no where compares to State, Nationals, PBA or even SASBA as far as Prestige and level of competition....
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Post by WineUdotKing on Feb 6, 2006 16:06:22 GMT -5
Well I will tell you this. When I go to a Knights of Columbus State or International tournament, I have never been to the house we have to bowl in and there are alot of other 210+ bowlers bowling in those events that I'm having to bowl against along with the large amount of handicap that I'm up against. In City tournament, you are bowling in houses you are familiar with and should bowl well. State tournament seems to go to the same house about every 5 years or so. It's not like walking into a different house every year. #nsrtrts_104# In addition to my 300 at State in 1995, I also have a State Doubles Title in 1986....just an FYI and the Title means more to me than the 300 game at State...That's the point I'm saying...it's just my opinion.... Nothing against Knights of Columbus, I'm sure it's a great organization...but your talking about house bowers that are 210 +....that's no where compares to State, Nationals, PBA or even SASBA as far as Prestige and level of competition.... "I'm sure it's a great organization...but your talking about house bowers that are 210 +"What is the difference between the 210+ "house bowlers" that I bowl against in the KC tournaments and the 210+ house bowlers you bowl against in City, State and even NATIONAL tournaments? They are both 210+ house bowlers in their own houses and we are not bowling in their houses. Nothing different. You bowl 1 weekend, they probably bowl a differnt weekend in both tournaments, too.
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Post by MrPerfect on Feb 6, 2006 16:38:17 GMT -5
I don't know how many State or National or scratch events you've bowled in the past but to my knowledge, you've never bowled any PBA Regional or PBA National events, or SASBA events as a guest as I have.....Because if you have, you'd know the difference.
House hero bowlers carry 205 to 215 these days in the 1 or 2 houses they bowl in and bowl the occasional City or State events... but they hardly ever do anything in these events because of they're lack of ability to adjust and beat other top bowlers. They just seem to do well in the houses they know, for the most part.
Top level bowlers will carry 225+ on these same shots such as what you and I do but to get the respect of other top bowlers, doing well in big events, such as the ones I named previously and in others such as the High Rollers (I've actually never bowled that one, but I will soon), gives a bowler notoriety and respect from his peers and sets them apart from the rest.
If a bowler wants true respect as a top bowler, then they have to bowl these events that attract the true top talent, not just the local yocal hero, and do well in them....JMO...
I have beaten, David Ozio, Mark Williams, Pete McCordic to name a few in PBA Regional events back in the 80's when they were traveling on Tour. and was back for the Summer to bowl some Regionals. And recently I have beaten Touring, Ex-Touring and Regional Pros in some of the M/G SASBA Tourns. I've bowled. This is what I'm talking about......I mean, how many bowlers from Pasadena have ever even competed against that caliber of bowlers?.....not many,Me, Jimmy Y., Mills, Falco and Mano has to my knowledge but are there any others?...
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Post by SoMuchHookUCanFish on Feb 6, 2006 18:45:44 GMT -5
I have beaten, David Ozio, Mark Williams, Pete McCordic to name a few in PBA Regional events back in the 80's when they were traveling on Tour. and was back for the Summer to bowl some Regionals. And recently I have beaten Touring, Ex-Touring and Regional Pros in some of the M/G SASBA Tourns. I've bowled. This is what I'm talking about......I mean, how many bowlers from Pasadena have ever even competed against that caliber of bowlers?.....not many,Me, Jimmy Y., Mills, Falco and Mano has to my knowledge but are there any others?... Everyone has a bad day.... I have beaten you my fair share of times does that make me as good as ozio and them?
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Post by MrPerfect on Feb 8, 2006 14:15:05 GMT -5
What good does it matter to compete locally when your are overlook EVERY YEAR Hall of Fame. Hall of Fame should consider all bowling not just a local bowling.Anybody can be a great house bowler. A great bowler competes in all facet of the game. Sorry thats what I feel. "olepro" called me today from Vegas and wanted me to post something for him on this forum, since soon after his post he made above, the site wouldn't let him post anymore for whatever reason and couldn't respond back right away. He wanted it understood, that his post was not directed toward anybody and was a general opinion of his own beliefs. Later after thinking about it and seeing some of the posts that followed he felt that some may have taken it personally or wrongly and didn't want any misunderstandings by anyone, especially "wine" that the post was not meant toward him in anyway. Also, I'm letting y'all know that Jimmy is doing very well at a couple of Tourns. in Vegas associated with the High Rollers. He's in the cash for sure and will be bowling the finals in two Tourns. If he were to win both, he could win 10,000.00 in one and 50,000.00 in the other, he said they made the mistake of giving him a twig shot and he's eating it up....You go Jimmy Young and good luck.
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Post by MrPerfect on Feb 8, 2006 14:26:39 GMT -5
I have beaten, David Ozio, Mark Williams, Pete McCordic to name a few in PBA Regional events back in the 80's when they were traveling on Tour. and was back for the Summer to bowl some Regionals. And recently I have beaten Touring, Ex-Touring and Regional Pros in some of the M/G SASBA Tourns. I've bowled. This is what I'm talking about......I mean, how many bowlers from Pasadena have ever even competed against that caliber of bowlers?.....not many,Me, Jimmy Y., Mills, Falco and Mano has to my knowledge but are there any others?... Everyone has a bad day.... I have beaten you my fair share of times does that make me as good as ozio and them? Actually bigjle, if you converted your spares a little better and became a little more consistent and gain some more experience with your game, you could very easily compete with anybody, bar-none....JMO.. but actually, the biggest thing you need to work on is your mental game and attitude at times...JMO... But don't feel bad, that's an acquired thing and many at your age don't have that aspect in their game either......but if you start working on it hard now, it will just put you that farther ahead of them in the future....again....JMO....
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Post by wannabearightie on Feb 11, 2006 23:13:55 GMT -5
i have bowled with jimmy and kirk before. they want it to be 35 and up because they both know that I will take their money in any tournament they wish to bowl. they all are all scared whether they like it or not. im not scared, if the tournaments last, i will take their money later after i turn 35.
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Post by MrPerfect on Feb 13, 2006 10:51:49 GMT -5
i have bowled with jimmy and kirk before. they want it to be 35 and up because they both know that I will take their money in any tournament they wish to bowl. they all are all scared whether they like it or not. im not scared, if the tournaments last, i will take their money later after i turn 35. Whatever...lol..... bring it on....lol...
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Post by MrPerfect on Jan 5, 2007 10:12:20 GMT -5
Just wanted to let y'all know that SASBA is having a M/G tourn. this weekend in Beaumont at Crossroads Lanes, it's the center that Mark Williams manages. The lane assignments are posted on SASBA's website, I have "B" squad bowling at 2:00 pm. I'm bowling with Chuck Schwakhofer out of Waco for this one and we're crossed with Jimmy Young and his partner Jack Zuniga. Shawn Swanson couldn't bowl it this year so Jimmy had to get a new partner. Mike Austin and his partner will be one pair over from us and David Ozio and Mark Laurencente' (Smurf) will be two pairs to our right. If Chuck and I can stay close to them, we can make the Finals easily. We'll be on their pair right after tham each game, so it will be easy for me to see where they are at. Plus I will be keeping an eye out for Ozio on what adjustments he makes from pair to pair and what ball he's throwing and what part of the lane he's playing....
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Post by ihookplastic on Jan 5, 2007 11:40:09 GMT -5
I just have to chime in on the 'handicap' and 'scratch' tournaments talk ... i won the all events at last year's Knights of Columbus state tournament and it is probably the accomplishment that I am most proud of ... i haven't had the opportunity to bowl in may other tournaments such as regionals, or the high roller, or sasba m/g ... but knowing that i beat a lot of good bowlers (including WineUDot, my Dad, Bubba Haney and many other 210+ and 220+ bowlers) for 9 games at a house that i had never set foot in before was something to be very proud of hey Clark, why isn't Bob Eason bowling this weekend? I'll be out there to watch you guys, instead of competing, since my Dad told me that he didn't think he could bowl that many games in a weekend
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Post by MrPerfect on Jan 5, 2007 11:47:14 GMT -5
I just have to chime in on the 'handicap' and 'scratch' tournaments talk ... i won the all events at last year's Knights of Columbus state tournament and it is probably the accomplishment that I am most proud of ... i haven't had the opportunity to bowl in may other tournaments such as regionals, or the high roller, or sasba m/g ... but knowing that i beat a lot of good bowlers (including WineUDot, my Dad, Bubba Haney and many other 210+ and 220+ bowlers) for 9 games at a house that i had never set foot in before was something to be very proud of hey Clark, why isn't Bob Eason bowling this weekend? I'll be out there to watch you guys, instead of competing, since my Dad told me that he didn't think he could bowl that many games in a weekend Congrats on the Knights of Columbus win in All-Events..... just be glad I didn't bowl it...lol...J/K.... I might of taken you....lol... I have bowled one with Chuck before and we did ok. He asked me to bowl and I said yes. It was nothing against Bob or anything, Chuck just asked me and Bob didn't. Just figured Bob had other plans and didn't want to bowl. Look forward to seeing you there, I'm on "B" squad that starts at 2:00pm..
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Post by WineUdotKing on Jan 5, 2007 13:58:50 GMT -5
I just have to chime in on the 'handicap' and 'scratch' tournaments talk ... i won the all events at last year's Knights of Columbus state tournament and it is probably the accomplishment that I am most proud of ... i haven't had the opportunity to bowl in may other tournaments such as regionals, or the high roller, or sasba m/g ... but knowing that i beat a lot of good bowlers (including WineUDot, my Dad, Bubba Haney and many other 210+ and 220+ bowlers) for 9 games at a house that i had never set foot in before was something to be very proud of hey Clark, why isn't Bob Eason bowling this weekend? I'll be out there to watch you guys, instead of competing, since my Dad told me that he didn't think he could bowl that many games in a weekend I was wondering who this screenname belonged to and now I know. Welcome to the forum JUNIOR...lol. Yes, you kicked all of arses last year and I did congratulate you and was VERY proud of you, but I am no where near up to par to compete like I used to and your dad's body was all screwed up, too. We will see what happens this year at Alpha...lol. Hopefully I will get a good report next week when I see the doctor and get off my medications that pull me down so bad and get my strength level back up so I can give you a little bit of competition. D A M N kids...lol
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