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Post by MrPerfect on Dec 11, 2006 15:28:02 GMT -5
There are always causes to scoring. I was looking at bottom line, the actual results, not the reasons.... If Arm I and Diamond were even in scoring then if plus 60 something is eighth at Diamond, then when we moved to Arm I, the cut should have gone to +120 to +130 something. But it only got to + 103 .... This is the only way you can truly look at scoring as a whole for the Tourn. among all bowlers...IMO.... I have to somewhat disagree with that conclusion because the top 8 may have been the only 8 to bowl well at Diamond and others were able to catch up and pass the top 8 from Diamond. I'm a prime example of that scoring difference. -60 at Diamond and +81 at Armadilla. I'll bet we could get the total scores from both centers and Armadilla total pins would be more than the Diamond total pins. I was in last place at Diamond and only finished like 17th overall at +21. Their were quiet a few people that were minus when the Diamond portion was done and only 2 or 3 finished minus. On the same token...Cory was first after Diamond and ended up what 3rd, 4th or 5th over all after bowling at Arm I?..... yes, there are some that shot better and those that shot worse...at either center but as a whole, the cut only moved up 30 something pins at Arm I. That indicates as a whole, Diamond was better scoring for more people than Arm I...because the cut after Diamond was +60 something.... |
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Post by WineUdotKing on Dec 11, 2006 15:39:47 GMT -5
I have to somewhat disagree with that conclusion because the top 8 may have been the only 8 to bowl well at Diamond and others were able to catch up and pass the top 8 from Diamond. I'm a prime example of that scoring difference. -60 at Diamond and +81 at Armadilla. I'll bet we could get the total scores from both centers and Armadilla total pins would be more than the Diamond total pins. I was in last place at Diamond and only finished like 17th overall at +21. Their were quiet a few people that were minus when the Diamond portion was done and only 2 or 3 finished minus. On the same token...Cory was first after Diamond and ended up what 3rd, 4th or 5th over all after bowling at Arm I?..... yes, there are some that shot better and those that shot worse...at either center but as a whole, the cut only moved up 30 something pins at Arm I. That indicates as a whole, Diamond was better scoring for more people than Arm I...because the cut after Diamond was +60 something.... You can throw the numbers anyway you want to. I'll bet that if we would take the scores that were shot at Armadilla and use them as the 1st 3 games and then added the 3 games from Diamond you would probably have a higher top 8 + than the top 8 + from Diamond and then you would be saying the opposite of what you are saying now. |
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Post by MrPerfect on Dec 11, 2006 15:49:50 GMT -5
On the same token...Cory was first after Diamond and ended up what 3rd, 4th or 5th over all after bowling at Arm I?..... yes, there are some that shot better and those that shot worse...at either center but as a whole, the cut only moved up 30 something pins at Arm I. That indicates as a whole, Diamond was better scoring for more people than Arm I...because the cut after Diamond was +60 something.... You can throw the numbers anyway you want to. I'll bet that if we would take the scores that were shot at Armadilla and use them as the 1st 3 games and then added the 3 games from Diamond you would probably have a higher top 8 + than the top 8 + from Diamond and then you would be saying the opposite of what you are saying now. You will always have a few that will shoot a ton at either house because the shot may cater to their game more than the other, like Jeremy for example. He actually shot well at both houses just more so a Arm I. I'm basing this off the cut line only which is what most scratch Tourns. of multiple game goes by....the majority of bowlers (how did they move as a group) Yes you had some go up and some go down but the cut line score did not double from what Diamonds cut line was.... I was 2nd after Diamond at +121. I only shot +64 at Arm I and I stayed in 2nd...along with the cut line only going up 30+ pins....I can't see how a person could say otherwise.... |
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Post by PBAHoFer on Dec 11, 2006 15:56:22 GMT -5
I just talked to Melissa P., she is going to print out the EXCEL sheet with the scores listed by game for Division 1 bowlers.
I will have it and post the numbers tomorrow morning.
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Post by WineUdotKing on Dec 11, 2006 16:07:25 GMT -5
I just talked to Melissa P., she is going to print out the EXCEL sheet with the scores listed by game for Division 1 bowlers. I will have it and post the numbers tomorrow morning. Lovely. |
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Post by MrPerfect on Dec 11, 2006 16:08:12 GMT -5
I just talked to Melissa P., she is going to print out the EXCEL sheet with the scores listed by game for Division 1 bowlers. I will have it and post the numbers tomorrow morning. That would be interesting to see. If a cut line can only go up 30 pins at Arm I, if Arm I was higher scoring than Diamond with their cut line at +60 something. But to be make it more accurate, you need to throw out the top two high and top two low overall. That would mean throw out mine and Jeremy's scores and whoever the low two scores were overall.... that way the high and lows don't skew the main pack of the field scores....JMO.... |
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Post by XBOM on Dec 11, 2006 16:23:55 GMT -5
I have to somewhat disagree with that conclusion because the top 8 may have been the only 8 to bowl well at Diamond and others were able to catch up and pass the top 8 from Diamond. I'm a prime example of that scoring difference. -60 at Diamond and +81 at Armadilla. I'll bet we could get the total scores from both centers and Armadilla total pins would be more than the Diamond total pins. I was in last place at Diamond and only finished like 17th overall at +21. Their were quiet a few people that were minus when the Diamond portion was done and only 2 or 3 finished minus. On the same token...Cory was first after Diamond and ended up what 3rd, 4th or 5th over all after bowling at Arm I?..... yes, there are some that shot better and those that shot worse...at either center but as a whole, the cut only moved up 30 something pins at Arm I. That indicates as a whole, Diamond was better scoring for more people than Arm I...because the cut after Diamond was +60 something.... How can anyone look at Cory Brod's scores and assume a cutline off of how he's bowling. For one perfect he's lefthanded and he's not Falco. And another reason is he's not the epitome of consisitant!!! Use another bowler for an example and maybe your arguement will retain a little water. Right now it's leaking like a 20 year old faucet!!!!!!!!!!! #nutkick# |
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Post by PBAHoFer on Dec 11, 2006 16:28:50 GMT -5
I just talked to Melissa P., she is going to print out the EXCEL sheet with the scores listed by game for Division 1 bowlers. I will have it and post the numbers tomorrow morning. That would be interesting to see. If a cut line can only go up 30 pins at Arm I, if Arm I was higher scoring than Diamond with their cut line at +60 something. But to be make it more accurate, you need to throw out the top two high and top two low overall. That would mean throw out mine and Jeremy's scores and whoever the low two scores were overall.... that way the high and lows don't skew the main pack of the field scores....JMO.... Seems like 663 was 8th Place after Diamond. |
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Post by MrPerfect on Dec 11, 2006 16:35:25 GMT -5
That would be interesting to see. If a cut line can only go up 30 pins at Arm I, if Arm I was higher scoring than Diamond with their cut line at +60 something. But to be make it more accurate, you need to throw out the top two high and top two low overall. That would mean throw out mine and Jeremy's scores and whoever the low two scores were overall.... that way the high and lows don't skew the main pack of the field scores....JMO.... Seems like 663 was 8th Place after Diamond. I believe that is correct. I remember Jeff Wood telling me what it was after Diamond and that he was only 20 pins off of that. He didn't make the finals so he wasn't able to make up that 20 pins on that supposedly higher scoring shot...lol... |
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Post by MrPerfect on Dec 11, 2006 16:37:52 GMT -5
On the same token...Cory was first after Diamond and ended up what 3rd, 4th or 5th over all after bowling at Arm I?..... yes, there are some that shot better and those that shot worse...at either center but as a whole, the cut only moved up 30 something pins at Arm I. That indicates as a whole, Diamond was better scoring for more people than Arm I...because the cut after Diamond was +60 something.... How can anyone look at Cory Brod's scores and assume a cutline off of how he's bowling. For one perfect he's lefthanded and he's not Falco. And another reason is he's not the epitome of consisitant!!! Use another bowler for an example and maybe your arguement will retain a little water. Right now it's leaking like a 20 year old faucet!!!!!!!!!!! #nutkick# I was also using what I scored in the different houses as well as a barometer. But what was the 8th place series at Arm I?... is the question. I really don't know that. But I bet it was lower than +63... just a hunch.... |
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Post by XBOM on Dec 11, 2006 16:48:09 GMT -5
Seems like 663 was 8th Place after Diamond. I believe that is correct. I remember Jeff Wood telling me what it was after Diamond and that he was only 20 pins off of that. He didn't make the finals so he wasn't able to make up that 20 pins on that supposedly higher scoring shot...lol... Ok Jeff Wood said he was 20 pins out of 8th after 3 games the cut was +103 which more than likely is 60 pins more than he bowled after Demon! I'll give jeff 630 something at Demon so he was needing almost 70 pins to make the cut. 670-680 doesn't sound like a lot but if any bowler puts enough pressure on himself it might as well be needing an 800 series one bad tap and they're DUN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
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Post by MrPerfect on Dec 11, 2006 16:58:52 GMT -5
I believe that is correct. I remember Jeff Wood telling me what it was after Diamond and that he was only 20 pins off of that. He didn't make the finals so he wasn't able to make up that 20 pins on that supposedly higher scoring shot...lol... Ok Jeff Wood said he was 20 pins out of 8th after 3 games the cut was +103 which more than likely is 60 pins more than he bowled after Demon! I'll give jeff 630 something at Demon so he was needing almost 70 pins to make the cut. 670-680 doesn't sound like a lot but if any bowler puts enough pressure on himself it might as well be needing an 800 series one bad tap and they're DUN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Jeff W. was on my pair at both houses and I don't remember exactly what he shot at Diamond but I thought is was in the low 640's.... so he was only needing a 663 or 664 to get in. that's only averaging 221 approx. a game to make up the difference.... that shouldn't of been a problem for a 220+ avg. bowler in that house and it being an easier shot....shooting a 680 or 690 should not have been much of a problem if we go by what Wine is thinking.... but he is only one example..... let's wait till PBA get's them all to be sure... |
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Post by PBAHoFer on Dec 12, 2006 12:26:13 GMT -5
I have a copy of the spreadsheet page with the scores from the All Star.
It is sorted by the top 8 after all 6 games, so without detailed analysis, which I don't have time to do today, I cannot figure out what the cut number did, I will make copies and let you guys look at it if you'd like...
20 bowlers x 3 games
At Diamond, the overall average (Division 1 is all I have) was 216.
There was 18 out of 60 games UNDER 200.
At Armadilla there was a total of 58 games as there was 1 W/D after 1 game.
Overall average was 213.
22 out of 58 games UNDER 200.
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Post by MrPerfect on Dec 12, 2006 12:32:41 GMT -5
I have a copy of the spreadsheet page with the scores from the All Star. It is sorted by the top 8 after all 6 games, so without detailed analysis, which I don't have time to do today, I cannot figure out what the cut number did, I will make copies and let you guys look at it if you'd like... 20 bowlers x 3 games At Diamond, the overall average (Division 1 is all I have) was 216. There was 18 out of 60 games UNDER 200. At Armadilla there was a total of 58 games as there was 1 W/D after 1 game. Overall average was 213. 22 out of 58 games UNDER 200. With what you have posted so far, it's sure looking like Diamond was higher scoring over all by more bowlers.... Just like I was saying yesterday.... ;D |
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Post by PBAHoFer on Dec 12, 2006 12:55:31 GMT -5
I have a copy of the spreadsheet page with the scores from the All Star. It is sorted by the top 8 after all 6 games, so without detailed analysis, which I don't have time to do today, I cannot figure out what the cut number did, I will make copies and let you guys look at it if you'd like... 20 bowlers x 3 games At Diamond, the overall average (Division 1 is all I have) was 216. There was 18 out of 60 games UNDER 200. At Armadilla there was a total of 58 games as there was 1 W/D after 1 game. Overall average was 213. 22 out of 58 games UNDER 200. With what you have posted so far, it's sure looking like Diamond was higher scoring over all by more bowlers.... Just like I was saying yesterday.... ;D The cut after Diamond was 667- Danny Trevino Kaleb Pugh had 689 and Rusty Davis had 699, they shot 573 and 585 @ Armadilla and got knocked out of the Top 8. Garland and Mike moved into the Top 8 after having 632 and 658 @ Diamond, they shot 737, 708 @ Armadilla. Jesse Rose missed by 1 pin, he had 635, 666. Top 8 and scores at each house Jeremy- 725, 802 perfect- 721, 664 Garland- 632, 737 Mike- 658, 708 EFB- 687, 658 Corey- 759, 584 Al Haynes- 693, 616 Danny Trevino- 667, 635 |
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